Steve Davidson posted a set of demands that the Puppies MUST meet to get into the good graces of the kickers.
Short answer, no. George RR Martin carries the entire blame for not being able to meet his deadlines all by himself.
I was going to drop the Hugo awards until next Spring at least. After all, other than the list for the noms coming up, there shouldn’t have been anything going on. Then THIS showed up from Wired. And it’s the biggest pile of crap that I’ve seen in this entire mess. Which is saying a lot. I’m going to point out that Amy had the opportunity to interview everybody involved on the puppy side, but ignored Sarah Hoyt’s large contribution in favor of the narrative. The same narrative that came out of the Tor press release right after the nominations were announced.
Chuck Gannon’s post about civility has some great points. But here’s a not so great reminder of just what the puppies were dealing with, right out of the box. This piece from April that showed up on my twitter feed, makes the points rather clear.
That’s how Brickmuppet Ken sums up the Hugo Awards.
I wish that the puppy kickers could see that.
Chuck Gannon posted on Larry’s blog, asking for civility.
That would have been nice in February if the other side had tried that. Unfortunately the goals of the people that we now know as the puppy kickers did not choose civility, they chose the tactic of personal destruction, lies and smears right form the start. IN every media outlet that would publish the press releases. I wrote a post about it back in April.
There is all is, most or less as it happened. civil discourse was never on the puppy kickers’ menu of choices. Heavy bombardment of tar and smear, was. The puppies, on the other hand, tried civility, kept most of the real nastiness they were blasted with private and tried reason as the stuff just weirder and weirder.
I mean seriously, how do you call a man married to a black woman for 20 years a racist? But they did, even after the family photos. The racist taunt was only the beginning. The puppy kickers regurgitated all sorts of stuff about what the puppies were without eve actually quoting something the puppies said. Which is strange considering just how much the puppies blogged about what was going on. Including me. I think we were pretty clear as to what we were about, but somehow the puppy kickers were too busy trying to destroy the puppies to listen.
As for Eric Flint’s “reasoned” discourse, I have a rather different take on that. That being that Eric has been more than a little bit of a jerk to his friend Brad publically during the whole imbroglio. Not to mention insulting the late Jim Baen when I posted about him earlier this year.
This post has the details.
If it were one time, I could understand it, but Eric continued to act like a true jerk, even as Brad was editing the stuff while preparing for deployment. The douchery was becoming world class.
Followed by a great piece on how to not understand the issue.
The way I see it is how can Eric turn around and look his friends in the face after all the stuff that’s happened. What can he say to Toni after this, to Tim Bolgeo, who gave his minicon a place at Libertycon, to Brad after hanging out with the puppy kickers. I know that I’ve lost a lot of respect for Eric over this.
Of course the true stupidity is Tor books making this all personal.
Irene Gallo managed to piss off large chunks of the SF community with her stupid and pointless remarks. Which she still hasn’t apologized for. And Tor itself doesn’t seem to understand that calling the readers Nazis is not a truly good thing. The remark though, is part and parcel of what we’ve been seeing all along from the puppy kickers.
Perhaps the biggest piece of arrogance on the part of the puppy kickers, the biggest turd in the punch bowl of the whole thing is that puppy kicker seem to believe that the Hugo Awards and SF in general are their personal property and fiefdom. They are willing to go to any lengths to demonstrate this including buying a bunch of sock puppet votes and creating the fiasco that we saw at Sasquan. The whole artillery barrage started because the “right” people were not nominated, as if nominations were something they dispensed and the rest of fandom had nothing to do with it. Then they started that stupid childish Noah Ward campaign with websites and everything.
The fact is that they felt compelled to act like total jerks throughout and then blamed the puppies for the fact that they felt compelled to act like jerks.
That childish “No Award” tactic did more than anything else to ruin the reputation in SF where it mattered, anybody who might want to become a SF fan. If the kids don’t get pulled in what’s SF’s Future?
I think that one problem we, the generation of fans that grew up in the 1970’s have is that by and large we don’t see what’s happened. We were lucky to grow up in a time when SF was freely available and diverse. When publishers were willing to take chances and keep stuff in print. Where authors like Poul Anderson had entire shelves to go through. when SF specialty stores existed. We don’t really realize that that’s all changed.
For all that ‘s bad about the 1970’s you could put together an Appendix N from stuff in your library or from the public library. The stuff out there in paperback was that diverse. The problem is that by and large that’s gone, the victim of changed tax laws, push marketing, chain stores and aggressive tie in publishing. What’s replaced it is a bland pile of grey mush and the stuff that gets run though editorial boards that are graduates of the Ivy Covered Snob Factories all of which are indoctrinated in a culture that is at odds with what people actually want.
The powers that be have had every opportunity to act in a civil manner, to create some sort of dialog. Surely they see the numbers if even outsiders like myself see them. Haven’t they noticed the declining cons, the empty shelves? But it seems as if they’ve lost touch with what SF is supposed to be about. They’ve become so wrapped up in “social justince” and saving the world that they’ve forgotten that the reason for all this is to provide readable entertainment. And the only discourse they seem to be able to have with people who disagree is attack and personal destruction. That’s the reason for war.
Recently, when I posted the File 770 link in a private group somebody pointed out this comment:
If you see anything about the current storm in science fiction one name that keeps popping up is Vox Day, real name Theodore Beale. You can’t go a day with out some post from a puppy kicker invoking Vox Day for all sorts of evils and horrible things that Vox is continually doing to the innocent CHORFs. The scary thing is that Vox is probably doing those things and even worse that the kickers haven’t seen coming yet.
Another great post from Dave Freer. The problem for the puppy kickers is that they shot away their credibility and now they have no arguments left. Once they burned the Hugos down and essentially gave everybody in SF but themselves the middle finger, they now find themselves in the position of discovering that they may not be able to put things back together again.
It’s probably the only thing that con men, politicians, lawyers (ok, most pols are lawyers, go figure) and sf authors have in common.
To be successful at any of these, you have to be credible. Writers (at least when they’re writing) have it easier than most of the others, because you can go back and edit those little mistakes, and make your characters just that much more plausible. It’s a convenience most con men, politicians, lawyers and other liars have to envy us for. Heh. They have to envy us for something. It’s usually not money.
The big problem – as most successful writers know — is that credibility is fragile. Break it once and the reader starts looking for more. The pleasantly gullible reader is gone, and with him, so often is the enjoyment of the story. The reader trusted you. That’s why you don’t make mistakes. That’s why…
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Just a thought. The biggest complaint by the puppy kickers were that the puppies somehow removed “choice” from the Hugo nominations. Yet isn’t that what they’ve been doing for decades now. I can’t remember a year when ANY Baen stuff except for Bujold was on a Hugo ballot or even on a Locus list. Of course the readers were making a choice and more and more it wasn’t to buy SF. That’s a choice where we all lose.
As people sort through the ashes of last weekend’s Hugo awards ceremony, I wanted to highlight some very good analysis by Hugo nominee Ken Burnside. Note, there is no framing from me. Ken wrote a very astute, very candid piece. You make up your own mind. — Brad
How the Hugos Crashed
(aka “The Diary of a Self-Deploying Human
Sandbag In The Culture War”)
By: Ken Burnside
—=== Part I: My Experiences ===—
The Puppy imbroglio is about politics overlaying a literary dispute, and like all political actions, it has no winners. Its major casualties are relationships, and the truth.
I signed up for the Sad Puppy list because I was told it was about getting representation for conservative and libertarian leaning storytellers in the Hugo nomination process. The request came in when a book I was published in was in its initial 90-day release window, and it counted as…
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